Anything OBEY related

General art-related discussion.
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jkw3000
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 10:15 am

It's turned into a bubble based on artists more than gallery being a brand name. No different than any other art based market - Shep's particular inauguration posters being the big deal as opposed to Yerena or Sabogal because, well, Shep.

Enough bubble talk though, I was only being facetious about this turning into Mondo Thread 3...
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Kramerica
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 10:19 am

tulip1637 wrote:This would be an amazing discussion that would be easier for me to ignore if you did it in the proper spot.
Shut the drymount up.
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When I'm done ranting about elite power that rules the planet under a totalitarian government that uses the media to keep people stupid, my throat gets parched. That's why I drink Orange Drink. - BH
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hunterjax
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 11:03 am

Kramerica wrote:I think market saturation and the bubble bursting are two different things that people sometimes confuse with one another, even though they are be related. From my perspective, the hobby has grown and shifted somewhat. There are more and more people making limited edition prints, especially in the pop culture scene, so there are plenty of chances to get something you like. Just because every release doesn't flip, I don't think that means there has been a bubble burst. Not when you still have releases that shoot to the moon initially like the Drive print. And while certain prints and artists have lost desirability, there are also prints that nobody thought much of upon release that keep increasing in value (like Ken Taylor's Beetlejuice for instance). There are also established artists that have been making prints for decades and are experiencing somewhat of a boom in popularity only recently, such as David Welker. Sure, if flipping prints was a business model for you, I can see how you might be disappointed in the state of the market, or at least the number of things released with an immediately great return. That has a lot to do with how much the hobby has grown though, more people trying to get in on a big score. To me though, the number of collectors is still growing and it doesn't seem to be slowing down. Even if some people are less interested because they can't make the money they want to.
I agree with most of what you're saying, but isn't this (the bolded sentence) the definition of a bubble? Doesn't the increase in output by galleries and artists plus the increase in the number of people buying and selling automatically lead to a bubble - just more out there in the market than ever before, so more supply, more choice means cheaper prices and reduction in value.

IDK, I was never good at economics.
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FOODRAP
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 11:15 am

my 2¢:

It all hogwash. Years ago when we opened up FlightClub people said the sneaker market would crash. Well guess what, sneakers are more prevalent than ever before! Im still flipping kicks, buying art and rocking new sneakers every week. Artists collaborations opened up the footwear markets to art collectors and vice versa. The print market is strong, its diverse and to contrary belief, it is not over saturated with artists, oh just the opposite, I think the market is at its best point in years. There is a plethora of artists offering works in all price ranges and although there may not be enough of every release to go around, theres always the next hyped up release that will make you forget missing out on the last. Theres artists holding back and allowing there portfolio / body of work to resonate in the market and theres people who don't do any prints like jose parla. So its all over the place but not going out of style or place. Beanie babies are not artist made, they are mass produced in limited quantities at factories in asia and not in an artists studio. Baseball cards? lol, like comic books, you can only rea the same sh!t over and over how many times.

On the shep vs ernesto tip. I think you are looking at it all the wrong way. Shepard Faireys prints were all images of empowering woman which was in tune with the Womens March on Washington. So obviously people gravitated towards this. They also show ethnic woman wearing stars and stripes. Much easier on the eyes and way more pleasant to see on a wall. Where in as Ernesto's print depicts an immigrant worker reaching for liberty? To be honest, I myself am a Brooklyn born Puerto Rican and loing at the image its harder for me to identify with it as a symbol of America opposed to the women. Thats just me. You can take that sh!t all out of context if you like but thats just me and IDGAF what ya think about my personal opinion.
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Kramerica
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 11:52 am

hunterjax wrote:
Kramerica wrote:I think market saturation and the bubble bursting are two different things that people sometimes confuse with one another, even though they are be related. From my perspective, the hobby has grown and shifted somewhat. There are more and more people making limited edition prints, especially in the pop culture scene, so there are plenty of chances to get something you like. Just because every release doesn't flip, I don't think that means there has been a bubble burst. Not when you still have releases that shoot to the moon initially like the Drive print. And while certain prints and artists have lost desirability, there are also prints that nobody thought much of upon release that keep increasing in value (like Ken Taylor's Beetlejuice for instance). There are also established artists that have been making prints for decades and are experiencing somewhat of a boom in popularity only recently, such as David Welker. Sure, if flipping prints was a business model for you, I can see how you might be disappointed in the state of the market, or at least the number of things released with an immediately great return. That has a lot to do with how much the hobby has grown though, more people trying to get in on a big score. To me though, the number of collectors is still growing and it doesn't seem to be slowing down. Even if some people are less interested because they can't make the money they want to.
I agree with most of what you're saying, but isn't this (the bolded sentence) the definition of a bubble? Doesn't the increase in output by galleries and artists plus the increase in the number of people buying and selling automatically lead to a bubble - just more out there in the market than ever before, so more supply, more choice means cheaper prices and reduction in value.

IDK, I was never good at economics.
Well, I don't think there isn't a bubble, I just don't think it has burst the way some people are describing.
When I'm done ranting about elite power that rules the planet under a totalitarian government that uses the media to keep people stupid, my throat gets parched. That's why I drink Orange Drink. - BH
spagucci1
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 12:01 pm

Ernesto's image is a Native American woman not an immigrant.
FOODRAP wrote:my 2¢:

It all hogwash. Years ago when we opened up FlightClub people said the sneaker market would crash. Well guess what, sneakers are more prevalent than ever before! Im still flipping kicks, buying art and rocking new sneakers every week. Artists collaborations opened up the footwear markets to art collectors and vice versa. The print market is strong, its diverse and to contrary belief, it is not over saturated with artists, oh just the opposite, I think the market is at its best point in years. There is a plethora of artists offering works in all price ranges and although there may not be enough of every release to go around, theres always the next hyped up release that will make you forget missing out on the last. Theres artists holding back and allowing there portfolio / body of work to resonate in the market and theres people who don't do any prints like jose parla. So its all over the place but not going out of style or place. Beanie babies are not artist made, they are mass produced in limited quantities at factories in asia and not in an artists studio. Baseball cards? lol, like comic books, you can only rea the same fudge over and over how many times.

On the shep vs ernesto tip. I think you are looking at it all the wrong way. Shepard Faireys prints were all images of empowering woman which was in tune with the Womens March on Washington. So obviously people gravitated towards this. They also show ethnic woman wearing stars and stripes. Much easier on the eyes and way more pleasant to see on a wall. Where in as Ernesto's print depicts an immigrant worker reaching for liberty? To be honest, I myself am a Brooklyn born Puerto Rican and loing at the image its harder for me to identify with it as a symbol of America opposed to the women. Thats just me. You can take that fudge all out of context if you like but thats just me and IDGAF what ya think about my personal opinion.
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GoBluePanic
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 12:22 pm

Where in as Ernesto's print depicts an immigrant worker reaching for liberty?
:lol:
I'm not someone else.
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hunterjax
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 12:24 pm

Kramerica wrote:Well, I don't think there isn't a bubble, I just don't think it has burst the way some people are describing.
Gotcha, and agree.
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nobokov
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 12:58 pm

Great discussion. I agree with Food, Sabogal and Yerenas images were pretty bad in comparison to Fairey's two images. You can see that the demand was based on how powerful the image was itself, not by just the name of the artist. Very little was made of the african american boy's photo (taken by Delphine Diallo), because the image itself was not striking in the particular context. The subject didn't confront the viewer with a powerfully confident gaze as in the other two images and I think was a poor choice for a print out of the other amazing photos that Diallo has taken over her career. Also, the words didn't seem to fit the image (Protect Each Other). Who are we protecting, the boy? Or is he protecting us?

The Sabogal image had a terrible color scheme, imo, and who still wears a backward cap? The Yerena image had an emaciated, toothless man or woman wearing an ill-fitting shirt - not a powerful image either.
o4phish20o
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 1:02 pm

I'm still waiting for the Banksy bubble to burst so I can buy a few dozen.
Can't wait for them to be back at cost!! Maybe during my lifetime?
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Codeblue
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 1:03 pm

Luls @ da fashion police ova here.
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nobokov
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 1:07 pm

Codeblue wrote:Luls @ da fashion police ova here.
Someone's gotta regulate
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mrsippycups
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 1:12 pm

nobokov wrote:
Codeblue wrote:Luls @ da fashion police ova here.
Someone's gotta regulate
I know how to handle my steel.
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spagucci1
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 1:22 pm

That was an African American girl not a boy.
nobokov wrote:Great discussion. I agree with Food, Sabogal and Yerenas images were pretty bad in comparison to Fairey's two images. You can see that the demand was based on how powerful the image was itself, not by just the name of the artist. Very little was made of the african american boy's photo (taken by Delphine Diallo), because the image itself was not striking in the particular context. The subject didn't confront the viewer with a powerfully confident gaze as in the other two images and I think was a poor choice for a print out of the other amazing photos that Diallo has taken over her career. Also, the words didn't seem to fit the image (Protect Each Other). Who are we protecting, the boy? Or is he protecting us?

The Sabogal image had a terrible color scheme, imo, and who still wears a backward cap? The Yerena image had an emaciated, toothless man or woman wearing an ill-fitting shirt - not a powerful image either.
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toobs
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Wed Feb 08, 2017 1:38 pm

spagucci1 wrote:That was an African American girl not a boy.
i thought it was nyjah huston . . .im so confused :wink:
Codeblue wrote:Ya know they'll put out at least 1 "ZOMG gotta rub mah nuts on another dukes butt to get in line for it" poster.
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