Damage etiquette???

General art-related discussion.
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bryndavies
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 4:55 pm

jjttdw wrote:LOL. Does this go down and a double-reverse call out thread?
Which I think is a double negative and makes the whole thing a wash. I could be wrong, though.
ImageT.K.C.
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hippiern
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 4:57 pm

well holy fudge, this thread took off...

I am very glad Mr P has joined this conversation. Now, hopefully some meaningful resolution can take place. The details of the transaction have been pretty much beat to death here, but since the buyer is present to reply I will restate my case here.

a. Framing a print to show damage cannot be acceptable. The first email i received stating there was damage to the print did not include any photos. I immediately replied, okay well lets get some adequate pictures to supply to USPS because the print did ship insured, and i would be filing a claim. I then receive the photos of the framed print, and was told there was no shipping tube damage. I wasn't until this occured, that i created this thread asking for opinions on whether I was correct in thinking that this was no longer my responsibility. I really didnt want a damaged print returned that was already hanging on his wall. Hardball, as you say? I guess, but I think most in this community would have done the same. Likely, there was probably some middle ground here that should have been explored.

b. Lack of communication. With no notification, paypal deducts all funds from my account with notification that chargeback was issued. I emailed the buyer for additional information at this time, including photos, etc to use to state use in my appeal to paypal. No reply. I ask then for the print to be returned. No reply. My appeal is denied, and I ask paypal to help me recover the print and he is sent several emails from them, which he ignores as well.

c. Bottom line. BUYER STILL HAS MY PRINT AND HAS BEEN 100% REFUNDED! I WOULD LIKE IT RETURNED ASAP.

where this damage occured remains unknown. had it been presented to me during unpackaging with tube and kraft in place, not much i can do but refund the buyer. if there is shipping damage, obviously, insurance claim. framing is a delicate matter, "cheap floater" or not. it is still not easy to get a rolled print to stay flat to put in any frame. you flatten with weights, then you frame. all i have is my word that the print was shipped in mint condition, though i have since taken the extra step of photographing every print i ship out at the edges and under different light for further proof of condition. as buyers, i would also suggest asking for photos prior to making a deal.

thanks to those whose intentions are trying to help resolve this.

dropdoctor, you are a total douche.
Last edited by hippiern on Wed Feb 18, 2015 6:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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HenryGaleWasHere
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 4:57 pm

I'm shocked this wasn't for a Mondo poster.
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Wockenfuss
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 4:58 pm

Double-secret callout.
Last edited by Wockenfuss on Wed Feb 18, 2015 5:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I Heart Haddonfield.
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chalkdust
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 4:58 pm

ooh delete that last name man, don't want you to get the ban hammer..
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ctankep
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 4:58 pm

_just use cotton gloves when putting prints in/out of frame

Image

should never have been framed, tho. that bad move just cascaded into this hilarious fudge-tornado, randy.
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Cragars
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 5:03 pm

Print was probably slightly larger than the frame he used. He put the print in the frame, closed it, drymounted up the print, realized this and blamed it on the seller.

Buyer's logic is flawed as drymount, his statements conflict with each other, he claims to know policy and then gets education busted all over his face and doesn't bat an eye. I'd be on the gatdamn phone with paypal raging at max capacity.
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Solar
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 5:07 pm

Cragars wrote:Print was probably slightly larger than the frame he used. He put the print in the frame, closed it, drymounted up the print, realized this and blamed it on the seller.

Buyer's logic is flawed as drymount, his statements conflict with each other, he claims to know policy and then gets education busted all over his face and doesn't bat an eye.
+1
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lsmith55
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 5:12 pm

Surely, we would all love to see the image of the print framed...
Image Don't try it, you drymount.
brentpye
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 5:13 pm

well holy fudge, this thread took off...

I am very glad Mr Pye has joined this conversation. Now, hopefully some meaningful resolution can take place. The details of the transaction have been pretty much beat to death here, but since the buyer is present to reply I will restate my case here.

a. Framing a print to show damage cannot be acceptable. The first email i received stating there was damage to the print did not include any photos. I immediately replied, okay well lets get some adequate pictures to supply to USPS because the print did ship insured, and i would be filing a claim. I then receive the photos of the framed print, and was told there was no shipping tube damage. I wasn't until this occured, that i created this thread asking for opinions on whether I was correct in thinking that this was no longer my responsibility. I really didnt want a damaged print returned that was already hanging on his wall. Hardball, as you say? I guess, but I think most in this community would have done the same. Likely, there was probably some middle ground here that should have been explored.

b. Lack of communication. With no notification, paypal deducts all funds from my account with notification that chargeback was issued. I emailed the buyer for additional information at this time, including photos, etc to use to state use in my appeal to paypal. No reply. I ask then for the print to be returned. No reply. My appeal is denied, and I ask paypal to help me recover the print and he is sent several emails from them, which he ignores as well.

c. Bottom line. BUYER STILL HAS MY PRINT AND HAS BEEN 100% REFUNDED! I WOULD LIKE IT RETURNED ASAP.

where this damage occured remains unknown. had it been presented to me during unpackaging with tube and kraft in place, not much i can do but refund the buyer. if there is shipping damage, obviously, insurance claim. framing is a delicate matter, "cheap floater" or not. it is still not easy to get a rolled print to stay flat to put in any frame. you flatten with weights, then you frame. all i have is my word that the print was shipped in mint condition, though i have since taken the extra step of photographing every print i ship out at the edges and under different light for further proof of condition. as buyers, i would also suggest asking for photos prior to making a deal.

thanks to those whose intentions are trying to help resolve this.

dropdoctor, you are a total douche.
Like I said, I have been professional about the whole process. Documenting everything and maintaining composure. I have not resulted to insults or demands outside of the lines of this claim. My reactions and comments are first hand experiences with Paypal, Ebay and companies outside of eBay. When I get the email that my creditor said I needed from the seller to maintain my refund in the case of further issues, I will gladly return the print. Just like I tried to return the print on day one. I maintain my stance and will always say that I did not damage this print and have never damaged a print in my possession or sold to another buyer. References can concur. I have never "screwed" anyone for a print. References can concur. Perhaps the seller didn't damage the print and it was damaged in the mail. It was damaged when I received it and the tube was in perfect shape. Regardless, its not up to me to dispute damages on a print that arrived damaged. That is to be taken up with the post office.
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Cragars
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 5:19 pm

Cragars wrote:
EXPLAIN HOW YOU DIDN'T TOUCH THE PRINT PUTTING IT IN THE FRAME.

EXPLAIN HOW FRAMING A PRINT DOES NOT ALTER IT'S STATE MORE THAN WEIGHTING IT DOWN AT THE CORNERS.
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beetlejuice
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 5:21 pm

So just ship the print back to him and then this thread becomes mostly meaningless.

Besides the fact that no one on here will ever deal with you.
Go ahead, make my millennium.
Whitey9457
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 5:29 pm

hippiern's post definitely makes me nervous about pretty much all potential sales in the future. Not saying that he did anything wrong but this just seems like nightmare scenario. If the poster was insured, can you still make a claim? If not, buyer should just return the print and both of you walk away having both lost a bit... insure it again during return shipping maybe?
Image
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ToonKiller
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 5:33 pm

Got refunded and kept the poster would it now not make it a stolen item? File police report, issue warrent, thief poster framer goes to jail, refunded poster $ is now spent to bond out + get lawyer, now go to court, get poster back, we're even ClownShoes.
Whitey9457
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Wed Feb 18, 2015 5:40 pm

So, just to understand it better (sorry i'm not gonna reread the entire thread) the buyer got a refund, but the seller appealed the refund so the buyer is holding onto the poster just in case the seller wins the appeal and gets his money back?
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