USPS woes :(

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hunkster
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Tue Aug 18, 2020 5:56 pm

hunkster wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 9:05 am
$1.05 for a domestic letter in the Netherlands and $1.75 for a letter within Europe.
FWIW, I find domestic kind of expensive!

How much is it in the States again?
I am wondering, do you have mail delivered on weekends and do you have door-to-door delivery?
[/quote]

Monday - Saturday and yes, door-to-door. We do not have the mail pick-up that USPS offers though, that is such a wonderful service, I wish they had that here
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bubbie
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Tue Aug 18, 2020 8:19 pm

jjttdw wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:00 pm
Larger area but fewer people than in California.
For sure. That, along with weather, puts cost advantage to your side though. Total revenue of Canada Post corporation is something like $8B, a drop in the bucket compared to the USPS.
jjttdw wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:00 pm
Has Canada Post retired their sled dogs?
Lol. I don’t really know. One would think so. I don’t believe I heard anything about it for at least a decade.


fallstaff wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:23 pm
Also the usage of the term “efficiency” in Capitalist doctrine is a highly-coded term that doesn’t carry over very well into a public service economy.
fallstaff wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:23 pm
I think a strong and solvent post office is vital to a strong and thriving democracy.
Good to see you around, mate!

Absolutely agree with you on that.
fallstaff wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:23 pm
One of the most important benefits of the PO is its willingness (and mandate) to be “inefficient.” For instance if a public transit system is privatized, that firm will quickly identify inefficient routes with low ridership and move to cut back service, more than likely in a low income neighborhoods that relies on that service.
Without a doubt, it should remain public, just like transit system, police, etc. But more efficient/cost-saving delivery methods should be implemented. Cost vs value is key. While inefficient routes carry high value to many individuals, daily to-the-door letter delivery does not, obviously. For example (I had a slow day today, so I did some reading, but more interested in our mailing system, yours maybe different):

However, in the twenty-first century, most Canadians now communicate digitally by way of email, social media, messaging apps, smart phones, etc. According to public opinion research, 91% of Canadians use the Internet and 69% pay their bills online rather than through the mail as was the preferred method only a few years ago.

...Less mail is delivered to more addresses, which has the effect of increasing Canada Post’s per-unit mail delivery costs.

...Transaction mail (domestic and international Lettermail™, including letters, bills, statements, invoices and postcards) volumes have declined by 32% or 1.6 billion pieces since 2006. This type of mail is no longer the main type of mail delivered despite still providing 50% of the Canada Post segment’s 2015 revenue of $6.3 billion in part as a result of stamp price increases in 2014.

...Most mail now delivered to the mail box is direct marketing mail, which is often referred to as Admail™. ...However, despite Admail™ making up 56% of mail volumes, it contributes only 19% of Canada Post’s revenues.

...All public opinion research focus groups conducted with Canadians indicate that Admail™ is viewed as “junk mail”. The fact that Admail™ now makes up the bulk of mail delivered to the mail box is proving an irritant among Canadians.

...Canada Post’s strategic focus has been “on growing revenues in parcels and the direct marketing businesses,” however, Admail™ is likely headed for a more significant decline as e-flyers are growing in popularity and usage among Canadians.

...At a time when mail boxes no longer receive mail every day, the Canadian Postal Service Charter also requires that Canada Post deliver mail five days a week. This is at odds with the views of surveyed Canadians, 73% of whom were open to the idea of alternate day delivery.


Taken from 2016 Canada Post in the digital age: Discussion paper. The benefit was marginal/not there back then and, logic suggests, it is even more marginal today. At least that’s true for Canada, but I can’t imagine us being so different.


35mmpaul wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:46 pm
reducing days and limiting where postal works drop off things isn't 'efficient' it's limiting to what people actually need.
That’s simply not true and doesn’t make much sense. In our case, from the same paper cited above (and in addition to the excerpts above):

Image

$577M in savings, with a stated revenue stream in 2015 of $6.3B, is significant.
35mmpaul wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:46 pm
'efficient' would be having a robust workforce that can handle the load.

more fuel efficient vehicles, better website (this is something they have improved on). more locations for dropping off and picking up mail.
Canada Post outsourced/franchised some of its locations/added more such pick up-drop off points a few years ago. There used to be 1 post office in town. Now there is that same corporate office, where all mail gets delivered and distributed from and another location where I can drop off my mail and pick up the parcels. The benefit to me is pretty straight forward: not only there is an additional place to drop off my mail, they are also open until 9PM vs the corporate location closing at 5PM.


35mmpaul wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:46 pm
reducing when and where mail is delivered isn't helping anyone. except some some bottom line that doesn't need to exists because its a public service people the world over use.
aldo wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:48 pm
$2b is .0004% of the US government's budget each year. It's a rounding error.
I don’t get this reasoning. It’s like saying my faucet is leaking water, but I won’t fix it because it’s just a few bucks on my utility bill and is completely insignificant when compared to my total monthly expenses. 2.2B is about $6 per person in the US, which, coincidentally, is probably an equivalent of a leaking faucet on your utility bill, lol.

Like I mentioned in my previous post, it’s a big chunk of change that can be used to finance other projects, including infrastructure, education, health care, and so on. For example:

Image

There was a brief discussion in the random thread not that long ago about teachers being grossly underpaid. $2.2B is 22,000 teachers being paid $100K per year. $2.2B is roughly half of WHO and Harvard University budgets.

$2.2B is not a rounding error, it’s actually a lot of money. Different strokes though, like I said previously.


35mmpaul wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:46 pm
the only advantage for fedex and ups is they have is that they might call me when they are outside. plenty of issues with the way they deliver things.
I agree.


trarex wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 4:11 pm
I've used 3 stamps this year and 95 percent of the mail i get is junk
For personal mail, my kids used a stamp to mail their drawings to my mom for her birthday. Pretty sure that’s it for our family so far this year. They will send a similar letter to my dad for his birthday later on.


hunkster wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 5:56 pm
Monday - Saturday and yes, door-to-door. We do not have the mail pick-up that USPS offers though, that is such a wonderful service, I wish they had that here
Interesting. Thanks for the reply.
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ygolohcysp
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Tue Aug 18, 2020 8:40 pm

The money for the USPS doesn't need to be taken from other social services. What do we spend on the military vs services for citizens? I don't use military services and neither does anyone else in this country. But we definitely pay for it. Let's shift some money into helping our people rather than helping the war machine. Infrastructure, healthcare, education and so on does not need to be underfunded because the money is going to the post office. These are services that citizens use. Take the money from the military for ALL these things. Dave Mustaine said it best... Killing is my business and business is good. And was it FDR that warned us in his departure about the military industrial complex?
So is the very structure of our society. In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.
And here we are.
A public relations nightmare

SLAPPED WITH FLIPPING
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35mmpaul
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Tue Aug 18, 2020 8:53 pm

the usps IS infrastructure. and with more robust and useful services it can help the economy and people who rely on it.

specifically all the artists and galleries that use the USPS for shipping practically everything they sell.

but beyond our little hobby there are many other buisness and humans that rely on the usps for essential needs.

and reducing services and availability do not help that. its nothing more complicated than that.

the things you are saying do not help packages get to where they need to go faster and more directly.
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bubbie
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Tue Aug 18, 2020 9:18 pm

^ I am taking about, as stated in at least two of my posts, what they call (terminology used in the article referenced above) transaction mail (domestic and international Lettermail, including letters, bills, statements, invoices and postcards). That’s all.

Parcel delivery is the future. Transaction mail is the past and can be delivered 2-3 times a week and that’s where those substantial savings come from. Community boxes have nothing to do with parcel/package delivery either.

Sorry, I thought I was clear about it.


ygolohcysp wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 8:40 pm
The money for the USPS doesn't need to be taken from other social services. What do we spend on the military vs services for citizens? I don't use military services and neither does anyone else in this country. But we definitely pay for it. Let's shift some money into helping our people rather than helping the war machine. Infrastructure, healthcare, education and so on does not need to be underfunded because the money is going to the post office. These are services that citizens use. Take the money from the military for ALL these things. Dave Mustaine said it best... Killing is my business and business is good. And was it FDR that warned us in his departure about the military industrial complex?
So is the very structure of our society. In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.
And here we are.
I agree (except that you do use the military services), but this is beyond the scope of the discussion and why the politics section disappeared, lol. So I won’t be commenting on this, lol.
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Bryman
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Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:15 pm

bubbie wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 9:18 pm
Transaction mail is the past and can be delivered 2-3 times a week
Or not at all as far as I’m concerned. The only paper I want showing up at my house comes in tubes.
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jjttdw
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Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:52 pm

bubbie wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 8:19 pm
jjttdw wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:00 pm
Has Canada Post retired their sled dogs?
Lol. I don’t really know. One would think so. I don’t believe I heard anything about it for at least a decade.
Perhaps that is because it takes a decade for the sled team to deliver the mail.

:tumbleweed:
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ygolohcysp
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Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:07 pm

Bryman wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:15 pm
bubbie wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 9:18 pm
Transaction mail is the past and can be delivered 2-3 times a week
Or not at all as far as I’m concerned. The only paper I want showing up at my house comes in tubes.
I don't disagree with either of you. When I think of the USPS I think of all the mail. It's so rare that I receive anything other than a package or advertising, pretty much everything transactional has an electronic version.
A public relations nightmare

SLAPPED WITH FLIPPING
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bubbie
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Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:12 am

^ I think that may have been the confusion and I wasn’t clear enough? I don’t know. Either way, I understand the necessity of “paper” mail, I just don’t see it being as relevant as it used to be. There is a lot of money to be saved in that department, money that then can be used to upgrade the fleet to more fuel efficient vehicles, etc. I also don’t see it as cutting the services, but evolving. I understand that many may disagree with this perspective, which is cool too.


jjttdw wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:52 pm
bubbie wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 8:19 pm
jjttdw wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:00 pm
Has Canada Post retired their sled dogs?
Lol. I don’t really know. One would think so. I don’t believe I heard anything about it for at least a decade.
Perhaps that is because it takes a decade for the sled team to deliver the mail.

:tumbleweed:
Ha!
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Codeblue
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Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:25 am

ygolohcysp wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 8:40 pm
The money for the USPS doesn't need to be taken from other social services. What do we spend on the military vs services for citizens? I don't use military services and neither does anyone else in this country. But we definitely pay for it. Let's shift some money into helping our people rather than helping the war machine. Infrastructure, healthcare, education and so on does not need to be underfunded because the money is going to the post office. These are services that citizens use. Take the money from the military for ALL these things. Dave Mustaine said it best... Killing is my business and business is good. And was it FDR that warned us in his departure about the military industrial complex?
So is the very structure of our society. In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.
And here we are.
It was Ike, making it all the more poignant.
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Grateful69Phish
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Wed Aug 19, 2020 5:51 am

great EB discussion :clap:
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trarex
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Wed Aug 19, 2020 11:25 am

:pint: On the lighter side after 33 days layover in LA and my prints found their way . :clap:
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fallstaff
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Sun Aug 23, 2020 12:04 am

bubbie wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 3:15 am
We have had our mail delivered to a mailbox like this

Image

for years now. It is located 50 steps from my house. There is one other box design as well that I saw elsewhere. The two larger compartments on the bottom left are for packages that fit the size; whatever can fit into the mailbox is put to the mailbox; anything larger than either gets delivered to the door. When I open my mailbox and see a key in it, that means there is a package in one of the boxes on the bottom left. Once I retrieve the package, I lock the box and deposit the key into the letter slot on top (left). I can also, however unlikely, drop off any letters I am mailing out into that slot as well, obviously. Our guy, most of the time, delivers any packages to the door for whatever reason. He also asked for permission to leave it by the door if there is no answer when he knocks. My garage is usually unlocked, so he leaves them there whenever the sky is grey. Normally, if there is no answer, they leave a slip on your door that you then take to the post office to get your fudge. Since this has been implemented, I usually check the mail a couple of times a week unless I am expecting a package and it isn’t delivered to my door. On an average week, I receive 2-4 letters, probably, that I don’t care for urgently for the most part because those are bills that get sent out by service providers that still don’t have electronic means of doing so (lame). There is also a bunch of flyers in there that I don’t care for either and they go straight to the recycling bin....


If they cut the residential letter type mail delivery service to 2-3 times a week, I wouldn’t even notice, personally (I understand that others may be affected and feel differently). And I doubt many would. Rural folks around here have a box at the post office where they can get their stuff whenever they drive for groceries and whatnot. Many rural communities still get their mail delivered to their doors though.
Bubbie, I have to hand it to you for your high tolerance in doing the tons of research on these matters. :notworthy:

In Oakland centralized mailboxes could be trouble because lately thieves are targeting the banks of boxes inside apartment lobbies. They’ve gotten hold of the postal master key and are getting into apartment lobbies, unlocking boxes and helping themselves. And lacking a key they discovered that a simple screw driver makes for a nice pry bar to easily pop open boxes, as they frequently do on our own boxes whenever the spirit moves them.

The other cost saving idea you mention about reduction of letter type delivery to alternate days would personally work for me, but I’m thinking businesses would still need daily delivery. As you pointed out, Canada polled the populace to get their feedback and that’s probably excellent idea here.
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bubbie
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Mon Aug 24, 2020 2:50 am

^ Lol. I wouldn’t call it tons of research. It is probably more than an average person does on a slow day though.

If you search google for images of “Canada Post community boxes”, most will probably be photos of vandalized and robbed boxes. I don’t see it as a major or widespread problem, however. It happens, for sure; but not as much as people would have one believe, at least here in Canada (or maybe I am misinformed and naive).

Maybe if the savings that can be had by modernizing the delivery system of letter type mail were put into education and social services, mail theft wouldn’t be that big of an issue. Who knows.

According to that same article above, businesses are in favour of “delayed” delivery by a much smaller proportion than individuals. If I recall correctly, something like 35% would support the decision. On the other hand, the same article indicates that only 60-some percent of businesses think that mail is still at all relevant or important. They will also adapt, I am sure.
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Grateful69Phish
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Mon Aug 24, 2020 6:40 am

if USPS went to widespread usage of the mailbox blocks obviously some alarms and cameras would be installed to capture some of those Oakland renegades .. that problem isnt everywhere by the way

once a few were prosecuted for FEDERAL felonies and went to jail for a Walmart flyer , my opinion should be forced into chain gangs and pick up trash in the fire zones - MAYBE those idiots would learn.

never understood why the cops dont do more stings when crime is so prevalent - scoop them up in mass and flush :roll:

it would also be very easy to take keys out of the picture completely- cars houses dont even have keys these days :lol:
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