Charlotte 11 Kawasaki

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sistinas
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Mon Aug 08, 2011 8:53 am

Super_Dank_Nugz wrote:What was the last timed edition print from Kawasaki?
I think it was January 23, 2010 when she offered a choice of “Yuuwaku” or “Hyakki Yakou” as the voting for them on her LJ had been so close

http://i-seldom-do.livejournal.com/147654.html

I remember bringing my laptop with me that day & then scrambling to find a Panera with wifi at the appointed hour and then the frustration when her website crashed. I think the 24 hour opening should make things run much smoother!

It was worth it for my Hyakki Yakou though!
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dsanacore
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Mon Aug 08, 2011 3:12 pm

So who's shooting to score the framed edition besides myself?
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wizdom
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Mon Aug 08, 2011 4:12 pm

I wish I could. Too steep for me, tho.
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tranito
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Mon Aug 08, 2011 5:29 pm

dsanacore wrote:So who's shooting to score the framed edition besides myself?
Me, but I'll need some help though (hint at those who are passing cause of the price tag).
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fallenangel1
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Sat Aug 13, 2011 9:11 am

it essentially has been said that they are charging higher prices to keep flippers from buying .. So we are paying flip prices up front to the artist instead of joe-dumb-ass sitting in his basement F5'ing all day long to try and make a quick buck .. Now I think Audrey 100% deserves the money more than any damn flipper .. BUT part of the fun in this hobby is "getting in on the ground floor".. You get in and buy something really nice like this for a typical market price and then when the prices go up we all feel good about ourselves and our investment in some beautiful art. BUUUTTTT .. with the prices already being so high AND the 24hr time release the market will be insanely flooded with this image and I THINK that the value will never go up .. It may even drop a little. Because no matter what there will be flippers still buying at $500 and then when they cant sell it they will drop the price to get out from under it and recoup something and when they sell it at $400 that factors into the market value and now billy-bob-new-collector thinks that these are only worth $400 and starts low-balling people at $350 .. and thats not even taking into account how the 24hr edition will effect the value of the larger framed prints ..

Although i see the logic behind what Audrey and company are doing .. i think it's a bad idea .. Even a collector wants to know that their money is well spent and the only way to know that is if you know you could sell your collection for at least near what you have invested in it and because of all the different factors from price and the 24hr window I think this one will be in the red as far as long term values go.

There is a reason why some print houses (like Mondo) do not do open editions (24hr window is damn near an open edition) and they have consistently kept their prices relatively low. They may not make as much money up front and flippers will day dream of all the money they will make when Mondo does a drop, but .. their fan base is constantly growing because they maintain the limited nature and affordability of their prints. Which is what a lot of us low-brow collectors want.

And in this case I think Audrey and Co. is essentially cutting off a large chunk of their fanbase by trying to play these games to combat flippers and take that money and put it in their own pockets and thats fine, please dont take that as a personal attack I wish there were no flippers and all true artist (leave that up for debate on who is a true artist or not :P) would reap the rewards of all their efforts!! I think the artist 100% deserve as much money as they can get from their art .. But at some point the inflated prices will shrink the fanbase and may hurt the long term collectible and sales of future prints.

Thats just my $.02 .. take it as you will :)

PS I do love this new print .. :D
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soma
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Sat Aug 13, 2011 11:42 am

just wondering if your philosophy takes into account that we did nearly this same thing 2 years ago with the 'two sisters' release and the secondary market of that print didn't faulter. http://www.expressobeans.com/public/detail.php/93666

also, i just want to throw into the equation that audrey's fanbase has practically doubled in the past couple years and she's offered fewer prints last year and this year than she has in years past.

just for discourse purposes, do any of those ideas change your opinion?
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sixstringer
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Sat Aug 13, 2011 12:05 pm

fallenangel1 wrote:it essentially has been said that they are charging higher prices to keep flippers from buying .. So we are paying flip prices up front to the artist instead of joe-dumb-ass sitting in his basement F5'ing all day long to try and make a quick buck .. Now I think Audrey 100% deserves the money more than any damn flipper .. BUT part of the fun in this hobby is "getting in on the ground floor".. You get in and buy something really nice like this for a typical market price and then when the prices go up we all feel good about ourselves and our investment in some beautiful art. BUUUTTTT .. with the prices already being so high AND the 24hr time release the market will be insanely flooded with this image and I THINK that the value will never go up .. It may even drop a little. Because no matter what there will be flippers still buying at $500 and then when they cant sell it they will drop the price to get out from under it and recoup something and when they sell it at $400 that factors into the market value and now billy-bob-new-collector thinks that these are only worth $400 and starts low-balling people at $350 .. and thats not even taking into account how the 24hr edition will effect the value of the larger framed prints ..

Although i see the logic behind what Audrey and company are doing .. i think it's a bad idea .. Even a collector wants to know that their money is well spent and the only way to know that is if you know you could sell your collection for at least near what you have invested in it and because of all the different factors from price and the 24hr window I think this one will be in the red as far as long term values go.

There is a reason why some print houses (like Mondo) do not do open editions (24hr window is damn near an open edition) and they have consistently kept their prices relatively low. They may not make as much money up front and flippers will day dream of all the money they will make when Mondo does a drop, but .. their fan base is constantly growing because they maintain the limited nature and affordability of their prints. Which is what a lot of us low-brow collectors want.

And in this case I think Audrey and Co. is essentially cutting off a large chunk of their fanbase by trying to play these games to combat flippers and take that money and put it in their own pockets and thats fine, please dont take that as a personal attack I wish there were no flippers and all true artist (leave that up for debate on who is a true artist or not :P) would reap the rewards of all their efforts!! I think the artist 100% deserve as much money as they can get from their art .. But at some point the inflated prices will shrink the fanbase and may hurt the long term collectible and sales of future prints.

Thats just my $.02 .. take it as you will :)
I don't think you intended it, but you actually come off like a bitter flipper complaining because this drop is priced a little out of your comfort zone and there is no guarantee to make a quick buck. I think your closing comments about hurting the fan base is way off (IMO). I think this style of drop INCREASES the fan base because you have a little something for all i.e. a very affordable timed edition print for casual fans or those with limited resources (like me) and then you have a premium framed version for the die-hards and those with deep pockets. This will be my first Kawasaki because the $100 price tag is quite doable. I don't think $500 for a archival framed limited print is that bad at all especially considering it coming right from the artist.

No offense intended, just my take...
Last edited by sixstringer on Sat Aug 13, 2011 12:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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flatland333
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Sat Aug 13, 2011 12:15 pm

TODAY IS THE DAY!!!
cant wait!!! this release got me pretty excited!!
for real i dont want to miss this one! :drool: :drool:
oiloncanvs
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Sat Aug 13, 2011 12:16 pm

Audrey works hard for what she can charge. I'm sure she just takes home a chunk, but not as big as a chunk as you would think. She's an absolute talent and can probably charge whatever price she feels like, it will still sell (well deserved). I think at her level it's not about making a dollar. Sure, she has to support herself and make some money, but the majority of what drives her is her love of art and her fans. She has worked hard in making her art pieces available to us. She, after all gave us a choice. That's more than most would do. Plus the fact that the framed pieces are framed in UV protectant acrylic shows the care towards the longevity of each piece. There's alot of care thats taken into each print.
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fallenangel1
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Sat Aug 13, 2011 12:50 pm

soma wrote:just wondering if your philosophy takes into account that we did nearly this same thing 2 years ago with the 'two sisters' release and the secondary market of that print didn't faulter. http://www.expressobeans.com/public/detail.php/93666

also, i just want to throw into the equation that audrey's fanbase has practically doubled in the past couple years and she's offered fewer prints last year and this year than she has in years past.

just for discourse purposes, do any of those ideas change your opinion?
It does some actually .. I guess it just shows the way different business models work. Its like whats the difference between buying a Ford or a Ferrari .. Essentially they are the same thing, a mode of transport. But, due to quality differences and use of the well known name brand the Ferrari will be priced well above any typical Ford .. But if we look at the number of sales I bet Ford sells more vehicles worldwide .. But Ferrari doesnt have to sell as many to make just as much money .. they both sell cars and make money .. So is one business model better than another? I think my frame of mind come from the low-brow side of things .. and Audrey is apparently a little more on the uppity-up side of things :) not good or bad .. just different ;)

sixstringer wrote:
I could be wrong but you actually come off like a bitter flipper complaining because this drop is priced a little out of your comfort zone and there is no guarantee to make a quick buck. I think your closing comments about hurting the fan base is way off (IMO). I think this style of drop INCREASES the fan base because you have a little something for all i.e. a very affordable timed edition print for casual fans or those with limited resources (like me) and then you have a premium framed version for the die-hards and those with deep pockets. This will be my first Kawasaki because the $100 price tag is quite doable. I don't think $500 for a archival framed limited print is that bad at all especially considering it coming right from the artist.

No offense intended, just my take...
WTF IS YOUR PROBLEM !?? WHY WOULD YOU CALL ME A FLIPPER !!! ;) Im just playing .. Its alright .. Thats one bad thing about the internet so much is lost in just plain text and its so open to interpretation. I was talking a lot about value .. but Im talking about long term value not immediate flip resale value.. I want to know that if/when the time comes for me to pass a piece a long that I will not take a huge loss .. and no matter what they admit when youre buying a $500 print everyone has to think about this at some point .. Or else everyone would be buying the drymounted commercial prints in your typical mall stores that can sell for hundreds up to thousands of dollars .. Just because they are pretty or have some dead movie star plastered on them. No collector that I know would even walk into a store like that let alone buy something from them because they know that the money they just spent was literally just for the artwork and it is never going to be worth anything to any other collector. Part of collecting is finding something that other people covet and because of that we covet ourselves .. A flipper doesnt covet anything but the money .. I will never be able to sell 90% of my collection because I truly covet it .. and FYI .. two pieces I have just happen to be the framed editions of Hyakki Yakou and Yuuwaku .. and I have had them hanging since I received them. Along with at least 20+/- other prints throughout my house. I am a collector first and everything else falls in after that .. I sell somethings when i feel I need to or if I made a spur of the moment purchase that I shouldnt have. But I truly am a hoarder and because of that I couldnt be a flipper .. Those two personalities just cant exist in the same person :P
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fallenangel1
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Sat Aug 13, 2011 12:55 pm

Oh and I just wanted to put this out there for what ever reason .. I still day dream about owning an Alone print .. :) I say print even though they dont exist just because I doubt I could ever afford the original !! ;)
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sixstringer
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Sat Aug 13, 2011 1:00 pm

fallenangel1 wrote:WTF IS YOUR PROBLEM !?? WHY WOULD YOU CALL ME A FLIPPER !!! ;)
:lol:
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fallenangel1
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Sat Aug 13, 2011 1:26 pm

and theyre up !!
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jojobadass
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Sat Aug 13, 2011 1:30 pm

The fairey model has worked for years.......raise the runs, not the price.
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GratefulRog
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Sat Aug 13, 2011 5:52 pm

sistinas wrote:
Super_Dank_Nugz wrote:What was the last timed edition print from Kawasaki?
I think it was January 23, 2010 when she offered a choice of “Yuuwaku” or “Hyakki Yakou” as the voting for them on her LJ had been so close

http://i-seldom-do.livejournal.com/147654.html

I remember bringing my laptop with me that day & then scrambling to find a Panera with wifi at the appointed hour and then the frustration when her website crashed. I think the 24 hour opening should make things run much smoother!

It was worth it for my Hyakki Yakou though!
Yeah...that was crazy. Server was as jaked as Fairey's during a drop. I finally got all the way through. A few days later, I got an e-mail asking which print I wanted because it didn't come across!!

I'm hoping 24 hrs gives them servers time to catch up!
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